From: Barry ([email protected])
Date: 07 Dec 2000
Time: 08:04:12
Remote Name: 62.253.64.4
Bruce, There was a LOT of correspondence recently on the team.net group. I have attached some comments, you may wish to edit! : - This weekend I had to take the Alvis to be MoT'd. Normally it starts easily, even when it has been standing for some time. Having charged up the battery I went to start it and it refused. Turning it over, it showed no signs of firing. A quick check of plugs showed a healthy spark. I must have been trying for about 10 minutes. I then put some new petrol in the tank to mix in with that already in, and it started almost straight away. Having been to the garage and got its MoT, I went for a run. When I tried to start it later in the day, it started immediately.
I then thought I would check the two Austin 7s. The Special, which had been trialled only two weeks ago, started on the button, but the Chummy, which has stood for a few weeks refused to start. Again, using similar tactics to those employed on the Alvis, it started and ran!
Does modern petrol go off more quickly than the real stuff? I have heard that it needs to be shaken up at regular intervals. Has anyone else experienced similar problems? Perhaps thois experiuence will encourage me to use the cars more often in the winter. Mike Harris
It does go off and neither of my two rarely-used A7's would start until new petrol was put in; they wouldn't even fire once. Normally, the low compression one would start even with a flat battery, "on the handle", but the high compression one one needed the battery really good. The other, regular-use one started with no trouble - but it is 12 volts.
Interestingly, my 1980 Ford RS2000 started with 18 month old petrol, even though as with many Fords of the era, it was difficult when left for more than a week. My industry spies tell me the poor fuel cap seals on the older cars are are to blame, letting valuable, volatile additives to evaporate. Bradex Easy-Start does the trick if taking the float chamber off becomes a nuisance and disposing of a tank full of petrol is difficult and virtually impossible to do responsibly. Once the cars start, then they seem to run on the old fuel happily until cold again.
Barry Lovelock.
To prevent it use a stabiliser product such as that marketed by Tecumseh. Should be available from any good lawnmower type establishment. I've tried it myself and it even seemed to fix fuel already a bit stale.It's not cheap but 10cc treats 5 galls John Hardy
I used....."Gold Eagle" Original STA-BIL concentrated fuel stabilizer in my petrol which apparently prevents petrol from going off. It's a US product made in Chicago, available from any auto parts store in the US. Imagine there's something similar in the UK. I also use Marvel Mystery Oil, which is an upper cylinder lubricant, similar to the old REDEX.
Good luck!
John Layzell Miami, Florida 1925 Alvis SC 12/50 - oldest Alvis in North America
Then:- I have been following the correspondence on stale fuel with some interest. I spent most of my working life in the oil industry and I cannot remember the technical term "going off" ever having been used in connection with petrol or any other product. I do however have fond memories of "going off" to the pub at lunchtime.
I can only think of three ways that petrol could deteriorate in storage, evaporation of the light fractions, oxidation and contamination. In sealed containers none of these should happen and shelf life should be years. In a vented car fuel system any of them could happen. Take your pick.
Unleaded petrol contains more aromatics than leaded to boost the octane. These are more prone to oxidation and gumming than the normal straight chain components, and are also more aggressive solvents to rubbers and gasket materials in old cars. So called "stabilisers" are probably anti oxidants, does anybody know for sure ?
Graham Orme-Bannister Alresford, Hampshire, UK
It's a big problem here it seems!!